Soft hanks and Soft shackles

[Jack]

In the process of re-rigging my boat over to synthetics, I have also been finding new ways to attach things with these amazing lines. The goal is to get away from steel and weight and holes in the boat as much as possible.. Or as much as is practical anyhow.

I posted some shots of "soft hanks" which came about as guys thought they wanted a better way to attach a sail to the stay. With bronze hanks (like I am currently using) there was the concern of chaff on a synthetic forestay. I have not tried these on the sail (I actually want to see if i get any chaff, I am betting I won't) but I have some made up, and have used them in place of steel shackles. So far so good.
I came up with the idea for this halyard soft shackle recently after seeing how the soft hank worked. I have not used it enough to recommend it. But they are easy to make and fun to work with.
The halyard rope is 3/16" Dynex. Very light, very strong.
Anyhow the photos of this ongoing project are at:

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...ner-22345.html

[Renoir]

Thanks Jack. I need a better description on how to make these things and use them. I can't quite "get it" just with the photos and little description. Hope you make a more detailed description that my slow mind can grasp.

I have to admit that even with Brion's books it wasn't until I bought his DVD video that I finally really "got it" in making splices in double-braid Dacron and nylon. This is after more than 30 years of making eye splices (yeah I admit that).

Thanks again,
Rick

[Jack]

Renoir, I posted some more photos at the same site that i were developing this week. I was describing two different Items that use the same set up. I have the soft hank/soft shackle (same thing) And I have the soft shackle that is spliced onto the end of the halyard.
So far I have seen no failures or damage, and I have been putting this stuff in some funny places that may not work over time, but I am trying to abuse things a little to see what we can get away with. I cannot really say these are the next great thing because i have not used them enough. I suspect they will be, but need more time and abuse to find out.
You need a hollow 12 braided line made out of Dynex, Spectra, Amsteel, all of them are UMHWPE.
I use 3/16" Dynex for my halyards. The black soft hanks are made from 5mm Marow Dux (a new product)
The halyard is simple. Just make a a tail as long as you need (about 5"plus enough for a stopper knot) Run the tail back inside the body of the line which will give you the eye you need. Bring the tail out the side of the line and tie a stopper knot in it. What you end up with is an eye with a flexible cover between the eye and the stopper knot.
To use it just slid the cover back a bit to open up the eye. Put the stopper knot inside and milk the cover back to the eye.
To make a soft shackle it is basically the same, except when you tie the stopper knot, you tie both the covers end and the tail end together.
It will take some fooling around to get it right. That is part of the fun of doing this kind of stuff.
Hope this helps.

[petermat]

Earlier today I had never heard of, let alone seen a "soft shackle", so please bear with me. I have looked at several threads here, and also several suppliers sites, and I am still very unclear. (I have looked at Jacks photos.) OK I see there is a stopper knot at one end and what looks like an eye splice at the other end. The stopper knot fits (just) through the eye. So why does the stopper knot not come back out of the eye, particularly in a flogging (jib) situation? And why are they so expensive - the cheapest I found was $30! For a few inches of line!

[Jack]

Go to:

http://www.colligomarine.com/

There are videos on operation of the softie, as well as how to make one up yourself.

Good job on research, this thread is 23 months old!

[petermat]

Jack,
Thanks for the info - the video in particular answered all my queries on how it works.

I can see uses, but in my current state of slowly decreasing ignorance, I seem to see one significant limitation. With a spinnaker type snap shackle, or a regular shackle with a bar, you can attach a line to the shackle by knot, whip or splice, and be confident that the shackle and line will stay together. I mean particularly while not in use. This does not seem possible with the soft shackle as shown. If one simply put an eye splice in the end of the sheet / halyard ... then the eye end of the shackle is likely to easily slip through the eye splice. One cannot seize or sew anything to the soft shackle as portraid, since the cover of the soft shackle line must be able to move over its core. The only way I can see of meeting this requirement would be to make the soft shackle with a very much longer loop, seized in the middle making a figure 8 with one loop the disconectable part. This disconectable part would have to be long enough that the cover could be pulled back enough despite the seizing.

Or am I still missing something?

Peter

[John D]

Peter,

Soft shackles are very flexible* in that you can build them to suit your purpose. Your suggested method of a long soft shackle seized to an eye-splice will work, but you have other options available.

You can extend the distance between the moving portion of the soft shackle and the diamond knot (described as a "spherical knot" in the video) and use this to luggage tag the soft shackle to the eye. After you've made the locking brummel measure off a little more than the circumfrence around the eye's cross-section and make another locking brummel ( A through B, then B through A) and tie the knot as in the video. Attach to the eye by passing the soft shackle portion through the loop created by the two legs luggage tag fashion. The diamond knot will be standing proud and it will be easy to snug the constricting loop of the soft shackle around it. This isn't going to shake of easily, but for security always close the shackle after use.

For an even more secure attachment of the soft shackle to the eye, you can build a double shackle with a single, central, knot. Again, follow the video up to the locking brummel. Call the end that just passed through the rope A and the other end B. On the B side mark a dot a brummel's length away from the brummel you just made. Mark a second dot 5 1/2" away from the first dot towards the B end. Feed the B end in at the second dot and out at the first dot (use a fid as in the video to open up the line). Use something (3/8” fid [as in the video] or a length of 3/8" line) to keep the constricting loop from collapsing. Next make your second brummel with the B end, just as you did earlier with the A end. It's best if B emerges on the same side as A. Pass A through B and B through A to make a third brummel. This brummel will be roughly perpendicular to the other two brummels. Use the A and B ends to tie the diamond knot. In use both of the soft shackles constricting loops will go over this knot at the center of the double soft shackle. Attach to the eye with one side of the shackle and use the other side to connect to the clew.

While the double shackle is a clever hack, I prefer the luggage tag method as its less work and 'feels' better. As you work with soft shackles you will probably find even better solutions.

John D.

*pun intended

[petermat]

OK, I am starting to get the message. Just (maybe) a couple more questions. How much is this all Dependant an the properties of dyneema? The hollow core is obviously crucial, but is there any other cheaper type of line which could be used for experiments or even real use in less strength critical applications?

[CAM]

ran across this the other day:




Original source here:
http://wmriggingnewport.wordpress.com/

[Jack]

I do not have any steel shackles on my boat anymore. Lashings, Softies, Spliced eyes, etc. have replaced all the SS. I suppose you could get some cheap hollow core poly (like water ski rope) and have at it if you want to practice. I had some on the side of my avon that came with the boat. It was getting horrible on the hands, so I replaced it with some new stuff. But I would never want to put any kind of a load on it.